Curse

vurod007 · Mar 04, 2008, 09:43 PM // 21:43

no offense, but beeing able to choose trought the game from al clases is just plain boring, I mean, whats the fun of the game if there is nothing that seperates me from other ppl? Dont u think it would be kinda boring if all players were the same?I like the fack that i can do with my necro think that some ppl with other profesions do, and i like the fact that i need help from other clases for some things becouse i cant do them with my necro. I think it would be sad if only money and things we have would seperate us. I like the diverzity and the fact that ppl who played war for a long time suck when they start playing with ele, and other way round

I think that there should be as more as posible clases in GW 2, becouse i think it is fun to know that not all the ppl have same abilities as you.But thats just my opinion.

MithranArkanere · Mar 04, 2008, 10:02 PM // 22:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by vurod007

no offense, but beeing able to choose trought the game from al clases is just plain boring, I mean, whats the fun of the game if there is nothing that seperates me from other ppl? Dont u think it would be kinda boring if all players were the same?I like the fack that i can do with my necro think that some ppl with other profesions do, and i like the fact that i need help from other clases for some things becouse i cant do them with my necro. I think it would be sad if only money and things we have would seperate us. I like the diverzity and the fact that ppl who played war for a long time suck when they start playing with ele, and other way round

I think that there should be as more as posible clases in GW 2, becouse i think it is fun to know that not all the ppl have same abilities as you.But thats just my opinion.

Choice would still be there.

You won't be able to be primary warrior and primary monk at the same time. But instead of ONE choice, there will be more. You can choose to be primary monk or primary warrior anytime, when you get tired of one thing, you can become another.

Just like with real life jobs and secondary professions.

If you focus in one, you may be better in that one, but nothing stops you from learning all.

ManiSan · Mar 05, 2008, 12:42 AM // 00:42

Yeah, and it would be a lot of fun to invest time and spend money to acquire another "primary" class. You'll have to make quests for some master and earn "ability points" to unlock the other classes.

Nevin · Mar 05, 2008, 07:18 PM // 19:18

It does make sense to be able to just to switch jobs however you want, as one does in real life. But I think there should be some sort of barrier, some sort of points that need to be gained and spent in order to gain access to a new profesison.

MithranArkanere · Mar 05, 2008, 07:57 PM // 19:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevin

It does make sense to be able to just to switch jobs however you want, as one does in real life. But I think there should be some sort of barrier, some sort of points that need to be gained and spent in order to gain access to a new profesison.

I think the best option is the the little lore we already know from GW2:
- Charr Warbands
- Asura Krewes.

Characters could start directed to one 'army' and learn while in it.
Once you are promoted, you can move to another.

So in PvP the change would be instant, but in PvE you'll have to gain access to other profession by making quests.

- Join the Golemancer Krewe.
- Join the Scout Krewe.
- Join the Paladin Krewe.
Etc.

Phoenix Tears · Mar 05, 2008, 08:50 PM // 20:50

Nah, i'm personally against this and its totally unlogic, when compared with the RL..
You can't be simple one day a professional X and next day you are a professional Y and then the day after that you are a professional Z >.>

Where's then please the sense in having multiple different characters, when you want to play universal chameleons ??? which should be able to be everythign whenever you want ...

Its also totally unlogic that a berserking unintelligent Warrior should be able to become an intelligent and very wise powerful Mage, not to mention the unlogic attribute changes that would mean then about more or less max HP/Energy in a sudden and more or less Energy Regeneration in a sudden.
This change about the system would be idiotic. To keep the game balanced and logical, the choice of your main gameplay profession must stay fixed, everythign else after that about secondary professions or evolution forms ect. can be everything totally different and non fixed, beign able for the player to change at will.

Chameleon Systems are crap, because characters should have to specialize into things to become at something very good ant not be able to simple learn everything and then be able to change professions at will - just looks weird and is absolutely unlogical.
-----------------

About topic:

I'd love to have a profession system Mix about GW1 and Ragnarok Online for GW2 because both systems together would give a perfect Evolution System.
RO's system alone is still nearly perfect, would have had this game not 1 typical problem, those asian games come ever with, that GW had not from the start on. The problem about forcing the players to pay to be able to reset your characters. And the implemention about a reincarnation system hasn't solved the problem, it made it only worser.

GW2 will become more into the direction of RO - starts alone by having at least a Max Lvl of 100.
This Max Level will allow Anet to give us also a much better Character Development System, because it will simple hopefully take more time, to develop our charas in GW2, than lesser as 24hours >.> Ok, so extreme long as in RO it shoudl not take naturally, where you have to grind train your character for more then 3 months or so, before you will hit lvl 100, but 30 days is a good requirement imo for lvl 100 in GW2, that would means, that a player would have to make per day an average of 3,33333.... levels per day and is absolutely not required too much.

- Create a Character - start as Citizin, who has no profession yet on a Tutorial Island, where the new player will see all core professions first somehow in action, before the players will be able after some first noob quests to choose his 1st. master, who should teach you how to become your chosen core profession

- When having done all quests of your first master and having become your chosen Core profession, the master will send you automatically to your next master on the Non-Tutorial Side, which will be then so long your master, until your character evolves his 1st. time.

- With lvl 20/60 a Character will be able to evolve into 1 of x possible stronger forms of the chosen core profession.
After making quests for other Master-NPC's the player will unlock the other not chosen evolution forms, so that the player becomes able, to change his evolution forms, like secondary professions in GW1. GW2 won't have then anymore the Secondary Profession system, like in GW1, because that system got then merged with the Evo System of RO.

Example:

GW: You are a Warrior and choose as 2nd. Monk , then you get displayed by the game as W/Mo < looks totally silly, as if your character would be only a dumb hybrid, half this, half that

GW2: You are as Core Profession a Warrior, then after reaching lvl 20 you decide to evolve your Warrior into a Berserker, so naturally won't your character be displayed anymore as Warrior, no, the shortcut will change then from W to B. So its then not anymore W20, it's then B20
--------
The Character Development of our Example Warrior would look then like this:

Lvl 0 - Citizin
Lvl 1-19 - Warrior
Lvl 20 - Warrior > Barbarian (here you have multiple choices)
Lvl 21-59 - Barbarian
Lvl 60 - Barbarian > Berserker (here you have only 1 choice, evolving to the professions master form)
Lvl 61-100 - Berserker

Such an Evolution profession System I'd love to see in GW2 - would increase the amount of playable professions increadible - yes, but the gameworld of GW2 would become massively unique, individual and full of live, where players would NOT meat every 10 steps on a clone of themself, players with same hair style, same face, same profession, same armor and same weapons ect., but alone fact 1-3 give enough of clones in GW1...

Through an Evolution System it will give much lesser clones in GW2, because so more choices of evolutions a player has, so alot bigger will be the grade of character individuality in GW2 and that was from the start on in GW1 one of its greatest lacks.

The Evolution Ladder is easily shown as:
Core > Expert > Master (Elite)
1-19**20-59**60-100

Musheen · Mar 05, 2008, 10:47 PM // 22:47

I don't think the idea is bad, but it isn't something that I would stick with for a very long time. I don't like having to start over with a character once I've already built one up.

I really like the current system where I can change up my attributes and skills whenever I want. I even think they could have taken it a step further and and allowed for changing the main class as well. Then you could mess around with any build that you wanted. The catch would be that you'd need to collect equipment for each of the main class types and take time to acquire a good set of skills. Something to work for.

An example:

I start out as a N/Me and max out my levels. Now I decide hey, it would be neat to switch and be a W. I could try and make the switch right away, but I'm guessing that my skills in warrior are pretty weak. So, maybe I should switch to N/W for a bit and purchase/cap some skills that I'm interested in, save up for some new warrior gear, and then give it a shot.

Personally, I'd prefer that over having extra character slots. Currently I don't even have a character for each slot, and of the characters I have I'm only ever playing one of them. There is so much to do in these worlds, don't make us start over if we want to try something new.

My 2 cents, for what they're worth....

MithranArkanere · Mar 06, 2008, 02:35 PM // 14:35

Oh, no.

The Ragnarok Online system no.

Ragnarok online is a GRINDFEST.

You are limited to 9 character slots per account, and it's IMPOSSIBLE to get one character with all professions.

No. It's much better the Final Fantays Tactics style, where you can always change profession anytime.

The tree and limited systems are HORRIBLE, because they limit what you can do and FORCE you to have various characters to try multiple things.

In GW2 there will be already difference races. If you multiply that with professions, you get TOO MUCH.

It's completely illogical that someone cannot learn something just because he learned something else before.

The logical thing is to have to spend MORE TIME to learn MORe THINGS.

You can focus in one profession and get to be very good in that one, or spread in many and spend more time in all of them.

And once you hit a level high enough, you are expert enough to learn everything without hindering your advance.

That's logical.

The best achievements of GW is the removal of re-roll and forced grind (yeah, I remember the titles, I said foorced, XD).
Quick map travel, quick secondary change, freely abandon to retry later quests, freely retry missions, freely redistribute attribute points, freely acquire skills, freely choose skills.

Most of the time, and with single exceptions like a couple of quests and titles like survivor and LDoA, your choice is never a limitation.

No matter the path you choose, you can go back later and take the other one.

The greatest achievement in GW is: NO REGRETS.

Any system adding regrets to the game. Would be wrong. Would be a critical mistake. Would be the worst thing to do.
GW should NEVER add a system making players think "I wish I choosed the other one".

It would be like not allowing to enter the Kurzick side if you chooses Luxon. Not allowing to take some heroes if you took other ones. Not allowing to learn some skills if you learnt others.

It would be a mistake.

Phoenix Tears · Mar 06, 2008, 04:54 PM // 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Ragnarok online is a GRINDFEST.

but only cause of 2 points, which are easily changeable in GW2 >.>

* RO had an idiotic unbalanced Character Development System around the required amounts of EXP for the higher Levels, which raised and raised only higher and higher to unhumanous amounts, which made training a Character a grindfest, but that can be easily solved in GW2

* And the mentioned typical problem of asian games, that they don#t enable their players to freely reset their characters, that you find only on P-Servers and even there those idiots of GM's often want you then to pay first a high fee >.< Thats where the system of GW comes then in to solve that.
(would you have read everything, you wouldn't go on the barricades now about RO lol)

Because I said, GW2 should not become a RO-Clone, it should just take those aspects which are good of the game about the Character Development System and fill the bad holes with gameplay systems from GW1 and then the game just needs balanced factors of raising EXp for the high levels, so that players won't have to grind for like a half year or longer, until they will reach with 1 character level 100 >.<
If you need like 30 days in an average, this absolutely enough, and still much much better, as when you can max your character in lesser then 24 hours -.- what is absolutely silly.

The Evolution System of RO is the best Character Development I can think of personally, it offers not only extreme good long term motivation, but also an extreme good grade of character individuality - combine this with the secondary profession exchange system, that lets players change thigns at any time at will with the evolution system, and it becomes perfect.
Having not, as you said these idiotic limitations, which let players very often think:

"Did I've better chosen to make X instead of Y".
------

Chameleon Systems are imo crap, because it is absolutely unlogical to change primary professions at will. As said, you can't be day X a professional Warrior, next day you're then a professional Elementalist and the day after that then a professional Ranger - that would be just stupid and weird, when players would exchange their primary professions, like people exchange their underwear -.-

It requires years of training and experience to become a masterlike warrior, as it also takes years over years to become a masterlike Mage of any of the Schools of Magic.

in real life I can't say also, today I'm a professional Police Man, tommorow I'm then a professional Captain of an Airplane with years of Flight Experience and the day after that then I'm a professional Professor at a University teaching many Students complex things like Quantum Physics.

That are 3 totally different jobs you can't simple compare with and make them instantly professional at will, whenever you want, because they require you different knowledges and and and...

A Police man which works for 10 years at the Police has a totally different Expeciene, then an Airplane Captain, who has 10 years of Flight Experience...

You get it, want I want to try to explain ?

In the same way we look at these examples here, we have to look at the professions ingame - every profession has its own different requirements and experiences which you receive through them and those can't be exchanged simple at will anytime whenever you want to do so.

Would I have in GW now a masterlike Warrior and would want to change it to an Elementalist, my character would have to be then a total Elementalist NOOB - with absolutely NO experience of what it means to be an Elementalist.
Not to mention that this Ex-Warrior would be at first sight simple too dumb to be an Elementalist -the Character would be strong, cause of lots of muscles, but they character would have to lack on intelligence and wisdom to become a good Elementalist to stay logical, it would also mean, when you get with time the Intelligence, you will lose again the muscles to keep it balanced.

Thats the simple gameplay of games like Diabolo, D&D ect., as anyone who plays MMORPG's or RPG's in general should know. Simple gameplay rules, like their are used also on traditional Pen&Paper RPG's like DSA (dunno if its called also so on English, when not - then it must be theoretical TBE oO - The Black Eye. On German its "Das Schwarze Auge"

To be a mighty Mage of any School of Magic, it is required to be intelligent and wise enough to be able to cast Magic Spells. A dumb Warrior with no brain, which wants to become in an instant a Wannabe-Mage should not be able to cast Spells. Also it is impossible to change from a Warrior into a Ranger, when the Warrior hasn't learned first, how to handle a Bow and has gotten enough Dexterity to be able to target good enough with the bow to be actually able to hit foes with arrows -.- its much harder to hit a moving foe with Bow&Arrow, when you have not enough Dexterity, as when you have simple to dash only into your foe to ram your Sword into its body.

One thing of GW, that was about the 2 class system ever idiotic unlogical, because the game had no Status System, where Players had also to develop their Characters in physical and mental Stats like Strength, Vitality, Agility, Intelligence, Wisdom, Courage and so on ...

I hope, this traditional System will find its way into GW2 too, because it will increase also the grade of individuality about Characters and with a Status System, a player becomes able to work much better on the personal development of their characters and players will be able to form much better the Strengths and Weaknesses of Characters to build their characters in all points so, like the players wants to have them - and then, when the player thinks, he/she made a mistake, then the player should be just able to reset all attributes AND Stats like in GW1 by removing the setted used points and settign them then again in a new constellation however the player wants to use them

/notsigned for idiotic Chameleon Systems where players should be able to change into everything whenever they want.
Change your Evolution Forms - yes, because it would be just an upgrade version of the Secondary Profession System.

Koudelka · Mar 06, 2008, 06:38 PM // 18:38

I wouldn't mind:

No class discrimination
No race = profession
No chose-to-be-this-but-can't-be-it-unless-you-grind-for-it

I'm not keen on having to lvl up that much to alter my profession or make an irrevocable skill choice. However, the magic word here is balance. I don't mind too much, as long as arenanet remembers that.

Mr Fizzle · Mar 06, 2008, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Hey as long as we can make whatever we like in pvp...

Limu Tolkki · Mar 06, 2008, 11:17 PM // 23:17

Tbh i dont really wanna see secondary professions. Warriors casting fireball and necromancer throwing spear isnt what i want to see. As said preaviously something like seen in oblivion would be cool.

Nevin · Mar 09, 2008, 06:01 PM // 18:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Limu Tolkki

Tbh i dont really wanna see secondary professions. Warriors casting fireball and necromancer throwing spear isnt what i want to see. As said preaviously something like seen in oblivion would be cool.

Thats very restricting, but if no one was a "Necro" or a "Warrior" from the start, who's to say what they can and cannot do based on appearance?

Holly Herro · Mar 10, 2008, 03:23 AM // 03:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faer

I can honestly say that I would not be disappointed if ArenaNet decided to clone the tried-and-true class sets that Blizzard has been using for years now. Stick to what works, and what pays the bills. And, if they do take a page from their predecessor's book, well... I'm rolling an Amazon/Hunter/Whatevertheycallitthistime. Move out of my way, fools, I have COLD ARROW!

Gogo Diablo 2 power! =]

Age · Mar 10, 2008, 03:32 AM // 03:32

How would these go with what char is already in the HoM.

Zahr Dalsk · Mar 10, 2008, 03:41 AM // 03:41

I'd like the Classless Non-Experience-Based Learn-By-Doing (CNEBLBD) system used in TESIII: Morrowind and TESIV: Oblivion.

AuraofMana · Mar 11, 2008, 06:16 AM // 06:16

DND system more plz.